If we didn’t have the archaic Electoral College system, she would have won. She won the popular vote by millions.
Yeah, that Electoral College sure jumped right out in front of her, only giving her 227 years to prepare.
Bernie would have won if the DNC wasn’t so heavily focused on it being her “turn”. And then it was Joes “turn” after that. Bernie was the only person Trump was afraid of.
Not saying you’re wrong or anything. Just adding to it.
That is entirely possible.
However, I am not convinced Bernie could have gotten an agenda through either. It’s not exactly like his political ideals are even loved by a lot of the Democrats in government.
Not saying I wouldn’t have wanted him for president, I voted for him. But I am not convinced he would have been any more effective than Carter.
It’s really hard to implement a progressive agenda when even the so-called left isn’t on that agenda’s side.
The left functionality doesn’t exist in this country. We stamped them out in the Cold War and replaced them with the new Democrats who were all for social progressivism but economically were beholden to corporate interests. Then you have the conservatives who are so socially regressive they think Sharia Law is a roadmap and are so in bed with corporate interests that they’d be fine if kids died in coal mines as long as someone at the top is getting paid.
We can’t have the true left back until we get voting reform. Ranked choice or approval voting is essential to allow 3rd part to have a chance to flourish without causing a spoiler effect. That will also pull the Overton window back to the left again as the two major political parties will have less of an incentive to court extremists and will see better results at the polls if their platforms appeal to as many people as possible.
Look to FDR as a model of what happens when a progressive agenda gets a firebrand President. It’s not like the politics were all that different, or Congress any less corrupt.
I disagree. The politics were a lot different. For example, the filibuster worked completely differently.
You only need 50%+ of the senate to change the rules that allow the filibuster.
Good luck with that.
The point is that it’s a self-imposed handicap. If a party has 50%+ in both houses and the presidency, they have the ability to pass whatever they like and choose not to use it.
That’s the point of the firebrand President. We have not had a President since FDR who knows how to stand up to special interests and even their own party when necessary.
This wasn’t true about Biden. The establishment didn’t care who won that primary, as long as it wasn’t Bernie. I think Harris was their first choice, but they flipped to Biden when she tanked.
Biden absolutely believes he “earned” his time as president. He’s a life long politician that went through all the steps for it.
Oh, Biden himself does actually believe that, but that’s true of pretty much every president. I do think it’s a little more extreme in his case than for most.
That may be, but he’s better at hiding it than Hillary. She seemed to always be making it clear that it was her turn. That message came across much more strongly than anything else.
And the entire center of the geographical US would look like the Appalachians, but who cares about “flyover country” anyway?
What does that even mean? What does it have to do with the fact that she would have won if the president, who serves the nation was elected by a national popular vote rather that one which weights Montana and Massachusetts equally?
Because, believe it or not, keeping Hillary from winning is not why the Electoral College exists.
One of the reasons the United States has been the breadbasket of the world is because our government has HAD to account for the interests of underpopulated agrarian areas that otherwise would be ignored because they wouldn’t get ELECTED otherwise. So we take care of our farmers.
Funny the way that works, isn’t it?
Our farmers are not taken care of by their senators and congresspeople so they need to be artificially weighed in favor of when it comes to the chief executive? I’m sorry, that’s just silly.
No it’s not. Sorry, you and I do not agree.
You’re right. We don’t agree. I don’t think giving a farmer a vote more powerful than a city dweller’s when it comes to who should run the entire nation is ludicrous. Making up for a state’s small population is what the senate is for.
Everyone’s vote for president should be counted equally.
Fair enough. But then again, if you didn’t have that, the campaigns of both sides would employ different strategies, leading to different outcomes.
Claiming that was the easiest election in history discounts the fact that just under half the voting public didn’t respect a very-experienced politician with a history of pro-people causes and perseverance; they wanted the man with no experience and scandals buzzing around him like flies.
Don’t hate the player.
almost as if the people who chose to not show up for her were the type of people who would feel disenfranchised by the primary process that crowned her as the candidate before they voted.
UK citizen here. Already had 3 women prime ministers.
It wasn’t that Hilary was a woman, simply she was more dislikable than Liz Truss and seemed to put nothing out to convince people to vote for her. It wasn’t clear at all what she stood for or what her platform was.
It came across as entitled and like she took the electorate for granted. No matter how great or good you think you are, or how bad your rival is, you still have to ask the electorate to lend you there vote.
Map room to fight climate change and you think it wasn’t clear?
She stood for literally nothing. Just like Biden. And the DNC was caught cheating during the early primaries to thwart Bernie. Just like how Biden went from 4th to 1st overnight after coordinated drop-outs in 2020. At least they didn’t actively commit fraud like in 2016 I guess.
She stood for the corporatist democrats. Hillary is, in my mind, the very avatar of the corporatist democrats. I will never forget Bernie going to attent picket lines while Hillary was attending $10,000/seat dinners. I ended up holding my nose and voting for her in the end, because a shitty Democrat on their worst day is still better than Trump. Anyway, I voted for her, so all this high minded “she was right” rhetoric just pisses me off even worse, tbh.
Just like how Biden went from 4th to 1st overnight after coordinated drop-outs in 2020.
I’m surprised how quickly it was forgotten. I feel like I remember it being an open secret at the time - and with a shove from Jim Clyburn at a key moment just to make sure.
Clyburn’s endorsement of Joe Biden on February 26, 2020, three days before the South Carolina primary, was considered pivotal in the 2020 Democratic presidential primaries. Several analyses have determined the endorsement changed the trajectory of the race, due to Clyburn’s influence over the state’s African-Americans, who make up the majority of its Democratic electorate. Until Clyburn’s endorsement, Biden had not won a single primary and had placed fourth, fifth, and a distant second in the Iowa, New Hampshire, and Nevada caucuses and primaries, respectively. Three days after the South Carolina primary, Biden took a delegate lead on Super Tuesday, and a month later he clinched the nomination.[69][70][71] Biden went on to win the 2020 Presidential election.
Wrong friendo. Here in the states the misogyny is real and pronounced.
Have you noticed what has happened to women’s reproductive rights in the past couple of years?
There are places far more misogynistic than the US that have had women presidents/heads of government. Pakistan of all places has had a woman prime minister.
Misogyny happens everywhere, but it doesn’t help fight it when calling the public misogynists because they didn’t support a dreadful candidate. A man can be a dreadful candidate, and so can a woman.
The degradation of women’s rights is down to failure of the Democrats to maintain balance in the supreme court. It also represents RBGs inability to step aside when Democrats were in power. Supreme Court justices should have some decency, retire at say 67, and allow a new generation to come along. Clinging on until 87 was insanely risky as you certainly need 5 to 10 years leeway to navigate out on your terms. RBG was eulogised, but her clinging to her seat undermined a careers work and any progress on women’s rights amongst other core rights.
Cool. Blame everyone but those to blame.
Do you want to tell me who you think was responsible for the 6 - 3 majority on the supreme court? Do you want to tell me how what I said was not the reason for that balance on the SC? Do you not think the overturning of Roe vs Wade was the erosion of women’s rights?
Why are you so fixated on a candidate from the past that was just no good?
Did you miss the part where republicans stonewalled any nominations?
You did, didn’t you.
https://www.npr.org/2023/07/13/1185496055/supreme-court-conservative-majority-thomas-trump-bush
Its in the rules. Dems got embarrassed because they assumed Republicans would play fairly. Which over decades, it has been proven, no they do not.
They left it wayyy too late in the term to do it. If you leave anything to the last minute, you have no margin for error.
What’s your excuses for why it was fine to leave it until last minute?
Id even say that her being a very-experienced politician was the problem, because people were fed up with the status quo
No, we wanted Bernie and abstained because both choices were disgusting.
How’d that work out? 😅
Do you remember the PUMAs in 2008? More Bernie Bros were willing to vote Hillary in the general than PUMAs were willing to vote Obama.
But we’re getting distracted, you can’t blame Bernie supporters because the politician chosen by the DNC had the blood of millions on her hands, and was just generally unlikable.
You run a politician that offers the people fuckall, of course they’re not gonna take a day off work to vote for you, they’d rather have the money.
I remember PUMA! It originally stood for “Party Unity, My Ass”. Can you imagine the uproar if Bernie supporters had done anything like that?
Her husband was a neoliberal who cheated on her with a subordinate while in office. Welcome to reality
What does that have to do with it?
And her opponent is a misogynistic chauvinist who mocks people with disabilities, diddles children, cheats on his wives, openly talks about sexually assaulting people, has open ties with Putin and Kim Jong-un, honestly I’d be here all day if I tried to scratch just the surface.
Yet voters were okay with him over a milquetoast career politician. She was held to a much higher standard than Trump ever was, hell she still is given that she is somehow being blamed for the farce that is Trump. Why don’t people blame him instead?
She never made a real attempt to meet the voters where they were. Bernie and Trump are both populists, and that was what the people wanted. They wanted–and still want–someone that makes them believe that their candidate will fight for them. Trump excites his base, because they feel like he’ll punish the people that they hate.
She never made a real attempt to meet the voters where they were.
LITERALLY. Didn’t visit Wisconsin during the entire campaign.
Of course, it’s never the party’s or the candidate’s fault, only ever blame the voters.
Voters are ultimately the ones who decide elections. Which is why we had Jan 6 and people getting pissy they couldn’t accept it.
It’s the candidate’s responsibility to win over the voters.
Pokemon go to the polls
I prefer this one
Okay but look at the young people. They went from bored to “oh my God, she’s talking about a thing I know!”
Some people need this stupid shit as much as I hate it.
Idk those are young people who already took the time to go to a Hillary Clinton rally. Maybe a few of them were inspired but the vast majority of young voters saw that as the pandering that it was.
I’m just saying watch all their faces. Especially the bored looking ones. Right when she says “I don’t know who invented pokemon go…” They light up and look at each other and get excited. Not that they’re excited about Hilary.
I definitely groaned. I remember her making a dumb fuck star wars reference at some point too that made me more angry than supportive. But you can’t make comments like “the vast majority of young voters saw it as pandering” as if that’s something verifiable. You just made it up hoping it’s true. I also hope it’s true. If they decided it’s pandering, it might have even been because their media told them so.
I talk to too many people who use campaign ads during The Bachelor as their greatest source of information on candidates.
FYI, The campaign coordinators also dropped a bunch of lures in the area and even chose the location because it’s a pokestop. Anyone who came hunting for Pokemon was met with volunteers holding voting registration sign ups.
Too bad they don’t pokemon go to the polls
I can’t imagine being 20 years old and being anything close to enthusiastic about Hillary Clinton. I also have to wonder how many of them were caught up in the moment of “Oh, are we clapping now?! She said a thing about…pokemon? Weird, but everyone’s cheering and since I’m a Hilldog stan and going with the flow is pretty much my entire personality I’ll clap and cheer too!”
I think this is the best:
“See the XcQ? The link stays blue.” No offense to Mr. Astley.
That was some seriously cringe slogan.
But how was this ever enough to justify voting for the guy who has no morality, cheats and bullshits his way through everything, selects his entourage based on loyalty over competence, divides the country through purposefully polarizing statements and filed for bankruptcies 6 times, 5 of which were casinos? And that was what we knew before he was elected.
That’s just showing how superficial a lot of the voter base really is.
My two cents: The average American has a literacy rate of 7th-8th grade and not only does Trump talk to that level he also repeats things constantly so people can remember it. Couple that with all conservative biased media constantly blasting the same messages people believe Trump was looking out for them. Compare to Hilary who has been painted as out of touch with voters and courting high value donors since Bill was president and the Bernie thing she needed to capture more independents but she didn’t.
No. It shows how bad a candidate she was. People love reform candidates for a reason: Washington is so dirty, and our interests are not corporate interests. Centrist Democrats inspire leftist voters to stay home or vote third party.
This this this! Guys listen to this guy. He is smart.
Obama won with a message that politicians were dirty and we needed a change.
Trump won with a message that politicians were dirty and we needed a change.
Biden barely won with a message that Trump was dirtier than politicians and we needed a change.
If you actually think that’s why Hillary lost…wow. Just WOW.
What don’t you understand about it was her turn?
Not a single reasonable person said this. The tweet is totally about how she was freaking terrible at campaigning.
You sound like a person who either didn’t go vote or voted for the guy who cheated on his wife with a porn star while his wife was at home with the newborn.
I voted for her. The ‘her turn’ meme stuck because of her utter inability to appear relatable, not because everyone thinks it’s something she said.
It didn’t help that two weeks before the election the director of the FBI was like “I think we should investigate her lol”
And then took it back two days after the election. I wonder what James Comey makes of himself in hindsight.
No, they didn’t take it back, they did investigate her and they did find the exact thing people said they would find.
The country probably would have been better off with her at the helm.
But the “claims” were accurate.
Although we did not find clear evidence that Secretary Clinton or her colleagues intended to violate laws governing the handling of classified information, there is evidence that they were extremely careless in their handling of very sensitive, highly classified information.
“She did it. Maybe without meaning to, but she did do it.”
He’s an institutionalist robot who thinks it was the right thing to do because that’s what the rules told him to do.
I’ve seen interviews a year or two after where he’s said he doesn’t regret it because it was important to address it due to her basically expecting to win.
Not sure if he still holds that to this day though seeing the fustercluck we’ve got.
You can lay that directly at the feet of Assange
You could, if you ignore history. Assange didn’t make anyone investigate anything. He was a journalist with no special powers.
Back in 2016, WikiLeaks was in direct communication with Trump Jr. and telling the campaign to claim the election was rigged and stolen if he lost. He was pulling a lot of stuff behind the scenes outside of the scope of journalism. It’s clear Assange was likely a mouthpiece for Russia to sow division in the US during this period.
You say he was not a journalist, but we’ve never seen good evidence of this. At worst, he was a bad journalist.
Anyway, maybe Democratic presidents and candidates could have considered the impact of their actions on his life. Did they think he would be sympathetic to them, after all they did or failed to do? This is common sense.
Pretty harsh to blame someone for being born a woman.
I dislike the establishment left, but 2016 was one of the most propagandized, misinformation filled, and corrupt elections - in no way can it be considered an “easy election”.
Hindsight is 20/20… The electorate sees no where near that well, and didn’t at the time.
The truth is fascism and pseudo or proto fascism is never an easy thing to defeat, because it breaks the rules and can appeal to forces and parts of human nature that most politicians won’t or can’t run with. This is why most fascists are praised as gifted speakers - even Trump - because they’re appealing to powerful parts of human nature which are usually not spoken about in politics, let alone addressed directly.
Let’s also remember that most people didn’t REALLY think Trump had a chance in 2016, even most Republicans voting for him. If everyone that would have voted against Trump had shown up (less than 60% of eligible voters turned out in 2016), it would have been no contest. He didn’t even get the popular vote in the end. But nobody took his campaign seriously and counted on everybody else to turn out to make the obvious but boring choice.
In 2020, though, we had the highest turnout of eligible voters since 1920 (still an embarrassing 66.6%). The only reason that the turnout for 2020 was so high is because so many people were so eager to either maintain or end Trump’s reign that people were charged up and went to the polls. The only realistic way that Trump doesn’t win this time though is if everyone who was so charged in 2020 remains as charged this time, or a new bunch of voters, like newly eligible young voters, show up in droves… and I’m very concerned that that doesn’t happen.
If everyone that would have voted against Trump had shown up (less than 60% of eligible voters turned out in 2016), it would have been no contest.
Everyone needs to read and comprehend this. The number of people who didn’t want Hillary or Trump was greater than the number of people who voted for them. But the system doesn’t reward abstaining. Trying to make a statement by not voting only serves to reward the people who you are abstaining from. Fucking vote, people! Write a candidate in if you have to. Vote for your dog. But get off your asses and use the right that hundreds of thousands of people died to protect.
One guy thought Trump had a chance. Ome guy kept saying that Trump was going to beat Hillary, and we needed a better strategy than hers.
I can’t imagine young voters being disenchanted more than they are when the Biden admin ignores their pleas to stop a genocide and walks all over them like spoiled children. He needs them now more than ever. I can’t see him realizing it, however.
Chapo Traphouse said it quite well with today’s episode: he isn’t willing to sacrifice his pride for the good of democracy. And Dems aren’t willing to shame and embarrass him to protect it either. We’re fucked.
Biden doesn’t actually believe in democracy. Biden supports democracy in the same way corporations support gay people during June. If Trump dismantles democracy, he doesn’t care. Biden’s big talk is all kayfabe. Biden is the face and Trump is the heel.
Threatening the DNC with a Trump presidency is like threatening your kids with McDonald’s
There’s nothing left about the DNC establishment. You need to update your terminology to be taken seriously.
I completely agree. Hillary was subject to non-stop manufactured scandals insinuating she was a complete criminal (Benghazi, the emails, etc.). Plus Trump successfully tapped into the “punish the libs” and “it’s okay to be racist” contingents. It wasn’t a great campaign, but to suggest that it should have been a cake walk for her is ridiculous.
I agree with you that it wasn’t a cakewalk, but the problem was she treated it like a cakewalk. She assumed she had it locked up, and ignored all polling that didn’t support her landslide victory. She punished downticket candidates who didn’t bend the knee by skipping their districts in places like Wisconsin and Michigan, because she assumed people would show up for her.
She ran a terrible campaign, kowtowing to the worst attacks, thinking it was politics as usual, acting like she was above the fray while she was face down in the mud getting stomped on.
She should have gone on the offensive. She should have presented a vision for a better America. She failed us all, and for that she deserves as much scorn as we can conjure.
Had she set foot in Michigan or Wisconsin at all during her campaign she probably would have won.
I don’t know, it seems like when she even mildly went on the offensive, people on both sides (and especially the media) ripped her for it. Remember the “deplorables” things?
For ages, I don’t think even Trump’s campaign thought he had much of a chance (many sources have said he didn’t even want to win). And remember, she did win the popular vote.
I don’t think she did nearly as well as she could have, but there’s a lot of hyperbole about her that I think is misplaced.
People were going to rip her for whatever she said. That’s politics. Welcome to professional politics.
I agree that Trump’s campaign seemed surprised to be doing as well as it was, but part of that was the DNC and Hillary pushing all the attention on him because they thought he was a clown making Republicans look bad. If that’s not the miscalculation of the century, I don’t know what beats it.
It’s easy to make her sound like a victim when you ignore the fact that she did everything in her power to rig the DNC primaries in her favor AND propped up Trump’s early campaign as much as she could. The situation we find ourselves in is certainly not exclusively her fault but she definitely deserves more of the blame than any of us do. She set the board exactly how she wanted and still couldn’t win the game.
A. What candidate wouldn’t use whatever was available to them to win the election? She obviously didn’t do anything illegal or Trump’s DOJ would have nailed her (and they sure tried).
B. Gonna need a source for the Hillary propped up Trump’s campaign part.
Illegal and anti-democratic aren’t always the same thing. You can certainly be one without the other. Though to be clear there have been allegations of outright illegal activity by the Clinton campaign and the DNC as a whole during the 2016 election, but the specifics are fuzzy in my memory and that’s not what you’re asking about so I won’t attempt to address it further here.
Here’s the first article I read through after a quick search to find a source for you. If you don’t like the source I’m sure you can use the timeline and references it contains to find something from a source you prefer.
https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2016/11/hillary-clinton-2016-donald-trump-214428/
Here’s a couple relevant snippets:
So to take [Jeb] Bush down, Clinton’s team drew up a plan to pump Trump up. Shortly after her kickoff, top aides organized a strategy call, whose agenda included a memo to the Democratic National Committee: “This memo is intended to outline the strategy and goals a potential Hillary Clinton presidential campaign would have regarding the 2016 Republican presidential field,” it read. “The variety of candidates is a positive here, and many of the lesser known can serve as a cudgel to move the more established candidates further to the right. In this scenario, we don’t want to marginalize the more extreme candidates, but make them more ‘Pied Piper’ candidates who actually represent the mainstream of the Republican Party,” read the memo.
Eleven days after those comments about McCain, Clinton aides sought to push the plan even further: An agenda item for top aides’ message planning meeting read, “How do we prevent Bush from bettering himself/how do we maximize Trump and others?"
This is why most fascists are praised as gifted speakers - even Trump
The fuck? I’ve never heard anyone say that. The guy can’t string two sentences together. Gifted? More like special needs.
I don’t know why people listen to Trump, but they do, and that means he’s good at speaking.
This nonsense. Sanders would have won that if the DNC wasn’t corrupt as shit.
I dislike the establishment left,
LOL, the what?
Genuine question, what is fascism?
You might want to look up Umberto Eco’s definition and I think it might be called something like “needs served by ur fascism”…
…but basically it’s authoritarian indoctrination into the idea that all individuals are subordinate to the state, and in order for them to be seen as having value they must give themselves entirely to the state’s goals and ideals to the point of happily, willingly, unquestioningly, and mindlessly giving their lives for/to the state.
It’s a kind of religious faith and fervor. It’s designed to replace and subordinate all other values and more often than not, places absolute power and faith in a single individual… And there’s often an irrational “cult of personality” around that individual. That person can “do no wrong” and is sometimes praised as a god or thought of as divine or having elements usually reserved for religion. They’re sometimes cast in the role of a father figure or God Emporer, and are always a “strong man leader”. Protection and veneration of them is the highest Aim in fascism (because everyone’s brainwashed by propaganda to believe he can do no wrong, and followers are sometimes scared to question or admit otherwise).
Fascism is named after the Roman “fascia” which was a bundle of sticks (sometimes with a long axe handle in the middle), that was used to beat unruly crowds and protestors (this goes along with the “strong man dictator imagery”). The internal fascist perspective is that this represents the strength through binding of strict rules into a community that is stronger than the sum of its parts, so the individuals no longer matter, they must move as the collective community of fascist believers demand.
So it’s a sort of radical authoritarian collectivism. It’s very much like a cult, but a cult that grips the whole of political society and the masses, it usually involves propaganda, and religious overtones, meaning the people giving up their rights, freedoms, bodies, and lives believe it’s in their best interests and may even get a substantial power trip from being the purveyors of popular violence in the name of their political religion. It usually involves political purges, and a complete conversion of society.
Fascism always requires enemies, and victims, people to target, blame, and be violent to. This often starts out as being the political opposition, then might also include demographic or ethnic or religious types, and almost always gay and queer people. Anyone different or who doesn’t abide by the group’s convictions around uniformity.
In Nazi Germany it was Gays, Jews, Subversives, and Criminals. In PolPot’s killing fields it was anyone who didn’t look Cambodian enough, or had any health defects, or disagreed or spoke out against the Khmer Rouge. In Hindu systems of Fascism it’s often Muslims.
Each culture and nations fascism has different aspects, but they all have key characteristics, which is what Umberto Eco was trying to define.
So that’s Fascism, named after some Roman shit, and usually has an angry “leather daddy” whose actually a loser at the top. It’s kinda pathetic and usually recruits people who don’t have a good sense of themselves and their own free will. People with low self-esteem who are angry and have grievances, who are upset at society or how it’s treated them, and who don’t question themselves or have a lot of empathy or self awareness of how others might be view things or be effected. Recruits are people who want to feel strong, but can’t for whatever reason. The group fascism makes them feel they’re being strong, and good, have a place in the world and brotherhood.
The best way to avoid fascism is to have a society based on shared community, transparency, justice, and empathy where everyone gets a say, but certain individualist limits are respected (eg. Self-autonomy, intellectual and political freedoms ect…) - and by making fascist movements and elements illegal or difficult to get away with. Also see Karl Popper’s “The Paradox of Tolerance”, or Herbert Marcuse’s essay on “Repressive Tolerance” for more on this.
Right wingers: YoU cAnT EvEn DeScRiBe FaScIsM. FaScIsM iS jUsT wHaTeVeR yOu DoNt LiKe!
Very very well said.
the establishment left
Real interesting way to refer to the center-right.
I wouldn’t even call them center right, anyone. They’re what the right used to be.
The DNC stole the nomination from Bernie Sanders. Thus losing the democrats the election. And us getting Trump. I was Pro Bernie myself, THeeeen Pro Trump. Because I figured Trump would fuck shit up enough it would get Americans to get off their lard asses and give a fuck. Didn’t realize he would try an actual, though pathetic, coup on january 6th.
It would have been easy if Clinton’s team hadn’t deliberately helped Trump, thinking that putting a fascist on the world stage would make their jobs easier.
“Obama has been doing a great job for 8 years and I plan to continue his legacy as best I can. We’re going to give more money to workers and students and also legalise weed.”
Boom. That’s all winning an election took in 2015. It’s Clinton’s fault she needed to go and defeat fascism and failed.
I think all the people saying they are voting for her because she is a women and everyone should vote for her or you are a sexist didn’t help.
She just seemed so unlikable and entitled.
Between a twenty year character assassination campaign by conservatives, her terrible personality, and not campaigning in places where it fucking mattered she fucking lost it.
Sure, a twenty year character assassination campain against her created the Bimbo Squad that … character assassinated, intimidated, harassed and blamed Bill’s victims. Republican conspiracy!
No. But “anyone Killary doesn’t like commits suicide bytwo bullets in the back of their head and locks themselves in a suitcase” definitely was. I’m not claiming the shit you said never happened. I also don’t think it stopped a lot of politicians from getting elected. Sure as fuck didn’t stop Bill. The dude she was up against has about the same level of shitbaggery. Didn’t stop him.
Are you such a rabid dog that when you see that last name you lose your shit? Because we’re having a nuanced discussion here. If you can’t comport yourself like an adult please go back to the kids’ table.
Nah, I blame the media. If any mainstream media actually bothered to report seriously on Bernie and especially the turnouts he was pulling at his rallies, we probably would have had more than enough people energized to vote in the primary and the general. Instead, the MSM acted like Bernie wasn’t a real candidate. I stopped supporting NPR after how dirty they did him.
Worst of all, they acted like trump was a real candidate, and handed him the unlimited exposure he needed to build a cult.
That’s not true. You don’t need any media exposure at all to build a cult. Cults are small. No, they gave him the media exposure he needed to build a religion. A big one. Much more dangerous.
If you’re still talking about Clinton, you’re why we got Trump instead of Sanders and I hate you for it.
I don’t think it was a particularly easy election. A majority of the people I know (which isn’t much admittedly) protest voted. Most thought her win was inevitable. I bet my friend in February that If it was Drumpf/Clinton, Drumpf would win. If so many people didn’t feel burned by her being picked over Sanders, she would have won electoral and popular.
Fuck all of you that think that Trump committed voter fraud only in 2020.
The reason she lost was that Trump cheated in the 2016 election, too.
That was why the world was stunned. Because the results were phony.
mmhmm I’m sure it had absolutely nothing to do with her terrible voter turnout
Which I’m sure had absolutely nothing to do with her sketchy performance under Obama.
And I’m sure not a single Democrat cared that the DNC went around saying “screw the primary we already chose our candidate” during the scam of a primary.
She still won the popular vote by millions. The thing is though, the electoral college is a relic that needs an overhaul at best, and that’s problematic for a lot of reasons. I largely agree with you though.
You know whose fault this is? Trump’s.
There’s a million liberals and leftists who made mistakes. But ultimately, Trump and his supporters are adults and they are the ones most to blame for what they’ve done. Not liking Hillary didn’t force anybody to vote for Trump; that was a choice they made.
She wasn’t right about a lot of things, specially relating to the Middle East. Misguided at best, malicious at worst when it comes to the Middle East.
