No. Imagining an independent future for any state (including California and Texas) is pure cope. The states are so interdependent that attempting to secede would be ruinous for the state in question.
The only exceptions I can think of are Alaska and Hawaii, which might be able to survive if they found another country to keep them supplied and economically connected.
Only as a last resort and everything else has been tried.
Fuck it why not. This country is proving to be a global liability due to its structure, size, and lack of codified protections for its own handling.
I support balkanizing the US
Coloradan. Only if a neighboring State does, because if not, we are neighboring other borders and we would be landlocked without food or water imports. Its either all Pacific and Front Range States agree we have to split, or none of us can.
Our most populous cities, Denver and CO Springs, are below the mountains, and are screwed in a combat scenario.
I don’t see Utah, Wyoming, Nevada, or Kansas doing so willingly.
New Mexico went Kamala. Border state.
In American balkanization I imagine yall would be a battleground of the literal variety. Colorado and new Mexico would want to join Pacifica and Nevada, Arizona, Wyoming, and Montana likely won’t. But also you’re valuable enough to justify putting up a stink for
Our water? It comes from dwindling snowpack due to climate change. I think you are overstating our pull here dude.
I think Colorado could force AZ to do what they want just by threatening to turn off the water.
This throws under the bus the many many non republicans in places gerrymandered such that the minority can continue it’s rule. My life would probably get better, but only at their expense as more and more solvent states leave the union. I’m not willing to ‘punish’ those people for the crime of being born in a impossibly corrupt district.
I’m not so sure. Once the Republicans no longer have the democrats to fight against, they will fight against each other. This might happen as well in the leaving blue states, but I feel like the democrates don’t hold as big of a majority in most of them. So they are already used to it. And they aren’t so much the party of fire and brimstone. So more likely they would try to do all the social reforms and just fall on thier faces.
I wholeheartedly agree.
Why did democrats not stop the gerrymandering? Why are there so many laws that should not exist still there?
And that outdated electoral college, smells like the fourth republic in france IMO.
Democrats do gerrymandering too. Basically without gerrymandering, the power would shift about 4% in Democrats favor. Enough to shift power in the House, but not as much as people think.
(That statistic comes from a video I watched a while ago, and could be wrong, so take it with a grain of salt. I’m not an authority on this matter.)
I suspect politics would actually shift a huge minority amount towards “no, don’t kill the planet, my grandchildren live here”.
The billionaire planet killers can afford to buy up and lock down two parties. I doubt they can afford to buy out everyone.
Because democrats have found a way to benefit from their own misuses of the law as well, so you can see how this leaves the people trying to change this with impossible choices they have to suffer consequences of even if they make the best one. It takes a lot of fight to stand up and keep pushing through that, and those are exactly the folk I’m proud to call my country-kin
Gotta break a few eggs, etc.
Might be cruel but kinda my thought. We can’t save everyone.
A bulkanized US would certainly be good for the planet, assuming it survived the preliminary civil wars as nation state boundaries are created and alliances made with Canada and Mexico. Who gains control of all the nukes would be a big question.
I don’t think the population is as hopelessly divided as the social media spaces make it out to be, but at the same time, the federal government looks more and more unrecoverable from corporate interests and back to the people every single day. It’s probably past the point of return, excepting major societal shakeup.
It feels like there may come a point where the states that are large enough to be countries on their own start looking into any mechanisms that would allow them separation, just to be able to run themselves without federal interference and incompetence.
We’re leaving the east coast? I think they deserve a path too
yeah if we figure out a way to not starve
Absolutely
- Sincerely, someone from the EU
Do states even have a legal way to secede?
Define “legal”.
Enshined in law, so that state can unilateraly decide to secede and federal govt must accept it.
No but there’s no law against expelling a state from the union. Kind of a reverse secession if you can piss trump off enough for him to actually do it (no law saying that only Congress can expel them, so it would go to the courts).
Didn’t have a way to legally secede from Britain
But this time there would be no ocean between the two sides.
See: American civil war
No. A full breakdown here https://youtu.be/1dhvry6E0jA
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.–That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, --That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness.
The Constitution of the US of frickin A
That’s the Preamble to the Declaration of Independence. And for as much as it is a foundational document of the US, it’s also not a legal document.
The preamble is part of the Constitution.
As to being a legal document, it’s not only a legal document (which the supreme Court uses as the final legal authority), but
The Constitution of the United States of America is the foundational legal document of the U.S. federal system.
https://www.britannica.com/topic/Constitution-of-the-United-States-of-America
The fact that I am being downloaded and you are being upvoted says something about why we’re having so much difficulty combating this administration’s excesses.
You are slightly wrong in every point.
The preamble to the Constitution is NOT the same as the preamble to the declaration of Independence. They were completely separate documents written more than a decade apart.
in fact:
The Declaration was rarely mentioned during the debates about the United States Constitution, and its language was not incorporated into that document.[44]: 92 George Mason’s draft of the Virginia Declaration of Rights was more influential, and its language was echoed in state constitutions and state bills of rights more often than Jefferson’s words.[44]: 90 [21]: 165–167 “In none of these documents”, wrote Pauline Maier, “is there any evidence whatsoever that the Declaration of Independence lived in men’s minds as a classic statement of American political principles.”[21]: 167
You have both corrected me well, I admit I was wrong. Sorry.
The Constitution of the US of frickin A
That’s the Deceleration of Independence.
New England. Maybe with NY, you could have New New.
Its part of why I moved out west. That and fear of persecution in the Midwest.
Washingtonian here, I’ve been saying this should happen for like 8 years now lmao
The marriage isn’t working. Let it go.
We have had a name for it for awhile, my fellow Washingtonians call the Washington/Oregon/California union ‘Cascadia’. Wouldn’t be such a bad idea.
Fuck yeah! Cascadia! Let us stop funding this awful government and actually put our taxes towards improving people’s lives
It would have a hell of a lot of economic power, and natural resources.
Sounds like the kind of place the US would invade
Absolutely, and I’m about ready to start identifying as that over American 🫠.
I usually think of BC being part of it, too, cause we’re so similar culturally, and we hang out on each other’s side of the made up invisible line all the time.
One can dream!
If you don’t take AZ and NV with you, you will get your Colorado River water cut off and lose a lot of farming power. That might even require UT. Unless it’s only Northern California included, in which case you still lose that agriculture, and possible land based trade lines to Mexico. It’s not a clean and pretty separation.
