AppData folder: am I a joke to you?
AFAIK appdata are stored in ~/.local/share, but you don’t even have that folder!?!?!
It’s not the Linux convention that’s fucked up in this regard, but your system.
If you want it stored in ~/AppData, you need to make a link to it from ~/.local/share.I’m no expert, so there may be other ways to do it. but apparently your system doesn’t follow conventions.
I even have a couple of things that found ~/.local but missed /share
He’s using windows.
But while we’re on the subject, ~/.local/share is cancer and shouldn’t exist.
The appropriate path is /usr/share.
I have a SystemD service that will erase anything written to that godforsaken .local folder, and if that breaks your shitty software then I’ll assume your shitty software doesn’t work and delete it and spam issues about it until you fix it or find a different career doing something productive, like cooking McRibs.
The appropriate path is /usr/share.
That’s a global folder, and not proper for storing “per user” data.
/usr/share? How is a random app getting write permissions to that?
I’m a little confused by that statement. Where should locally installed (non-sudo) applications, such as virtual python envs who are accessed by multiple other not-necessarily-python apps or perhaps baloo, flatpak, etc, store their shared data? I’m rather convinced that giving all users write access to /usr/share is a terrible idea.
I have a SystemD service
The irony is how lennart and his cancer approached standards, top to bottom.
Now I want McRibs.
He’s using Windows
WHAT? So he chose an OS that doesn’t follow Linux standard on PURPOSE?!?! That doesn’t make much sense. 😋
Is there an easy to find style guide of how Windows would like you to use these things, cause I never found one.
Appdata, my documents, program files… Everyone seems to be all over the place
I believe the intent is to use appdata for user-specific configs and programdata for system-wide configs.
A lot of apps mess up local vs roaming AppData too. Roaming is for things that would make sense in a roaming profile (ie to sync to other systems) whereas local is for things that should only exist on this system (caches, machine-specific configs, etc)
Program files require admin
Appdata doesn’t
Documents doesn’t either but in theory it’s for files you want the user to edit or backup
If you’re on a Windows box, the apps you’re calling out are assuming some level of FHS or XDG compatibility, neither of which are Windows things.
If you’re on a mac, macOS uses its own thing but can play well with dotdirs. However, you’ll find a mix of assuming XDG and weird macOS storage locations depending on how the tool determines storage location priority.
If you’re on Linux, there are too many standards.
Though, XDG says you need a .config/|.local/… fallback, if the variables are not set.
I hate it. I think a lot of devs who write cross-platform open-source software just use the %userprofile% automatic env variable to dump dotfiles in Windows since it can basically directly replace $HOME. In my opinion using something like %localappdata% is definitely preferred.
I mean… those are hidden by default
That doesn’t make it better though. App data should be under app data, either roaming or local depending on use.
still. it’s the year 2025. XDG_CONFIG should be the standard assumption
I don’t think so. If they were, they’d look shaded like the AppData folder does.
They have a dot in front. Means they are not shown my default, not even in cli
That’s simply not how it works on Windows.
https://superuser.com/questions/1064112/hiding-files-starting-with-a-dot
Who actually keeps hidden folders hidden? It’s like the first box I check when I open a file explorer for the first time.
To be fair this is how I clean as well
Amazed that no one can figure out a .config/ or .local/ already
Sure, AppData exists, but do you expect them to… read?
Everyone here is talking about conventions used on Linux, but this looks like Windows Explorer to me…?
Why are there so many directory names in there following Linux “hidden file” conventions, if that’s the case?If you write cross-platform software, the easiest solution is usually to pretend everything’s Unix. You’ll hit some problems (e.g. assuming all filesystem APIs always use UTF-8 will bite you on Windows, which switched to UCS2 before UTF-8 or UTF-16 were invented, so now uses UTF-16 for Unicode-aware functions as that’s the one that’s ABI compatible with UCS2, and passing UTF-8 to the eight-bit-char functions requires you to opt into that mode explicitly), but mostly everything will just work. There’s no
XDG_CONFIGtelling you to put these files anywhere in particular, as Windows is Windows, so most things use~as a fallback, which Windows knows to treat asUSERPROFILE%.)
Lots of frameworks for applications and games have automatic translation of file paths to sensible directories, but when you’re writing software you’re probably doing shit fast and dirty until it’s ready for release, by that time you now have a bunch of people relying on your software so changing the file structure will cause loads of issues.
Because developers use cross-compilable languages to pump out Windows executables without knowing or understanding or caring about the Windows environment. I mean,
~/.whateverstill works under Windows.This is not a Linux or Windows thing. It’s a lazy developer thing. It’s also another one of the ways that some devs will coddle the end-user because “learning a file directory system is hard.”
for someone regularly using both: it is a convenience feature.
that way i just know config files are under
~/.myApp. if windows devs would beore consistent, i would be ok withAPPDATA%\myApp. however, too often it is underAPPDATA%\myApp\..\Roaming\myApp- which is just a pain. so i prefere linux style on windows.I think you meant %LOCALAPPDATA%
%APPDATA% points to roaming
I see your point, but as someone who prefers my home folder be my home folder, I prefer they put it under
~/.configregardless of what operating system is being used.yes, i could get behind that. problem is probably that this is such wide spread by now, that it would take a really long time to use that new standard.
Roaming and local are there for reasons.
Mostly enterprisey ones, but roaming “roams” with your user profile.
If you have ever used a system where you could sign onto any computer and your stuff would be there, it’s mostly due to roaming folder.
Local is local to the pc and does not roam to others
I’m pretty sure the .file notation is a bug-turned-feature of a GNU coreutils program, Windows has no such thing and marks files as hidden using filesystem attributes.
I couldn’t say whether I prefer it one way or the other, but the dot prefix does stick out like a sore thumb on systems that don’t hide them by default… though I think AnyOldName3’s explaination makes sense.
The guidelines for Windows developers kinda suck tbh. Maybe it’s better these days, but plenty of weird legacy software behaviour can be blamed on MSDN.
They are using windows wrong, put everything on the desktop and don’t worry about all those scary files everywhere else.
/S
I realize that the OP is a Windows case, but I’d be rich if I had a penny for every time a savegame or config file is stored somewhere totally whack.
I’d be rich if I had a penny for every time a savegame or config file is stored somewhere totally whack.
Fun thing of you enable protected folders on windows: No app can get write access your Documents folder (or Images or Videos or…) unless you put them explicitly on the whitelist. That means you get to experience all the programs that are crashing or hanging or… just because they’re simply assuming that that’s the best place to dump data and because these folders always exist, you don’t need proper error handling in case you cannot access them…
Once Microaoft/Windows blocked access to the Root path of one of my drives.
That was surprising.IIRC the default for the root of the drives in Windows is an analog to Linux / which should be root:root 755.
The difference: When Windows displays the UAC dialog and asks you to elevate, it will (mostly?) just add your user to the ACL list instead of elevating your file browser while you access the drive. If ACLs are inherited from other folders below, that can have serious side effects…
I’m completely self-taught when it comes to Linux, so I have some obvious gaps in my knowledge. I’ve looked for good write-ups on how Linux folders are intended for use and been unable to find a good resource. Thank you for sharing the official standard name. Reading up on it now.
You might find the XDG base directory standard interesting also, solves the problem the meme is about.
That’s respectable! But yeah, the FHS is something that’s surprisingly hard to find in-depth information about if you don’t already know about it.
I think this page from systemd (or this page from the arch wiki, if you prefer formatting) has a decent description of not only the FHS, but also the more standard user/home structures.
I continue to be impressed with the Arch community and their dedication to collecting information about Linux into one place. Props to everyone that has contributed! You really are helping users solve problems everyday!
People pretend Arch is a DIY OS but really it’s a lego kit with homemade instructions and sometimes a little capuchin comes up to help you put some of the pieces together.
I gave up using the default documents folder because a lot of game developers think that is a good place to store the saves
don’t do
ls -laat your home directoryThis is why i never use the default folders, I will always make my own elsewhere.
It’s frustrating when apps apply Linux-specific behavior to other platforms. No windows apps should be just throwing hidden folders into the user directory!
I began using SMPlayer, which uses MPV, and yeah, it was confusing having to mess around in %localappdata%. But unironically, having to do so kinda prepared me for the switch to linux, what with getting used to using the filesystem.
Man: project zomboid just creates a “Zomboid” folder in home, not even with a leading dot.
whispers Zombocom
fun fact: that dotfiles are hidden on *nix systems was just a bug in the first version of ls (the dev originally only wanted to hide the “.” and “…” entry and not every file starting with .), but before the 2nd version could roll around, people have already deemed it a usefull feature so it was never changed.
That’s neat!
