I’m using EndeavourOS with KDE.
The display is correctly oriented when logged in but it doesn’t rotate correctly when I’m logged out.
EDIT: corrected the post. This happens when logged out, locking the screen has it displayed correctly.
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Seems fine to me
Is this when the screen is locked or when you’re logged out? Those are two different things and I suspect it’s the latter. That’s probably sddm and I suspect it can be fixed by using Wayland with it. Should be some option in
/etc/sddm.confor so.I corrected the post, thanks for calling it out! It’s fine when locked but the issue happens when logged out.
This sort of passive-aggressive “help” feels like a relic of the early 2010s we could do without.
OP probably wasn’t aware it was an SDDM issue. Or even what SDDM is, hence the question.
Well, there was zero effort documented in the post. So I guess we’ll never know what OP knows or doesn’t know or what they’ve already tried or not.
Take a look at Ubuntu trying to teach newcomers how to ask a question.
We aren’t Ubuntu here. As far as I’m concerned OP’s question was just fine.
That’s what you got from that?
“We aren’t Ubuntu” ?
It’s about how to ask questions in a technical form. A general “benefit” to all involved in the process.
The goal of Ubuntu’s help forum is to solve users’ problems efficiently and effectively. That goal is better achieved if questions are posed in certain optimal ways.
The goal of Lemmy is for people to have discussions (like this one! ;). That goal is not better achieved with well posed questions.
lol
Well, there was zero effort documented in the post.
You’re not their teacher. It’s not your job to decide how much effort they’ve put forth, or to grade whether or not that is sufficient.
Take a look at Ubuntu trying to teach newcomers how to ask a question.
And if they documented their research process, you’d say “tldr just ask the question.” Stop trying to be paternalistic and gatekeepy. Just answer or don’t.
You’re right. The days of quality moderation and standards are over. Now we have millions of useless posts being archived like this one.
Now we have millions of useless posts being archived like this one.
The archives! Why won’t anyone think of the archives!?
If we have room for comments like yours in the archives then we have room for legitimate questions by beginners in there too. Your post history shows a significant amount of deleted comments and downvotes. I bet they were all very productive and helpful comments for the archives, right?
That’s totally the biggest problem with the internet. And definitely deploying self-important moderaptors is the way to fix it.
/s, of course. Get off your high horse.
Sure, let’s keep criticizing anyone who points out to new users how to empower themselves. I would never post a lmgtfy link if there was an actual discussion taking place.
Not only did I respond to his question first, that link had both the answer and a link to the arch wiki. Perhaps enlightening OP on steps they could take next time. On their own.
“Help” would mean OP has tried a number of things and still having trouble. I don’t see any sign of that here. While I admit the lmgtfy link is a bit passive-aggressive, it drives home a point I’m comfortable making ever time I see posts like this.
How do you think the OP is supposed to know that “SDDM” is the issue to look up? You don’t get to enforce another person’s effort. If all you want to provide is "you’re looking for ‘SDDM,’ that would provide help and empower them without sounding like you’re biting the newbie for not knowing everything.
How do you think the OP is supposed to know that “SDDM” is the issue to look up?
Are you serious?
Because using OPs own words and typing in “kde login rotation” into Google immediately comes up with results talking about SDDM.
The laziness is strong.
Yes. I would assume that the problem is in X11 or Wayland before thinking it could be SDDM, frankly. But even then, googling “Linux login screen” doesn’t immediately reveal SDDM to be the point of concern.
Why do you keep moving like the goal posts around? I explained to you how minimal effort on a user’s part can lead to answers, which can lead to new questions and answers.
I’m not moving any goalposts at all. I’m expressing how inexperience and bad assumptions can make one’s searching unfruitful through no fault of their own. That’s all I’ve ever been saying.
Ah, you made an edit. Yeah, “kde login rotation” does, but “EndeavourOS login rotation” gives you no results mentioning SDDM. Giving people the benefit of the doubt costs you nothing over assuming that they’re lazy, and the added bonus is that you don’t sound like a jerk.
Ah, you made an edit.
The edit was a new line removal and your whataboutism is exhausting.
Edit: actually I don’t remember what was changed anymore. Every once in a while I see conversations like the ones in this post and I see red.
What I do remember is that I’ve stuck to my point and no one will convince me that laziness actually helps research and explaining to others how to do things better is unacceptable.
This type of answer wouldn’t exist if people typed the question into google instead of reddit/lemmy/forums/etc…
When you search for a problem like this one, often the results with helpful answers are on forums. These wouldn’t exist if no one ever asked their question on a forum.
To put it another way, google doesn’t create any content. That’s what we’re here to do instaed.
I have no problem with questions on forums, sometimes I ask them myself, but I think that if you expect people to try to answer your question, people should be able to expect you to have tried looking for an answer yourself.
Why though? Seriously, why is it a problem for you if they ask here first, instead of asking somewhere else first? What is the actual harm to you?
Some people would rather interact with other humans. Some prefer to find their answers without interacting with other humans. It’s all good.
Sometimes people like community conversation; it often gets to the heart of the issue better than parsing a semi-related post from 12 years ago, and it allows back-and-forth discussion to get details and drill down issues.
On top of that, redundancy for technical issues is never something we should reject.
I don’t know about other people, but it’s way easier to google something than to ask a question and then wait for the answer. I’m not OP, but if I’ve asked a question, it’s only because I’ve exhausted my ability to find the answer on its own.
Yup, and it might be necessary to reproduce a lot of the answers that people used to find on reddit.
That’s such an incredibly shallow thought. No one is arguing you can’t ask questions. The complaint has always been about how to ask a question. How to ask a good question.
If someone has done a little research and explained in their post at least ONE step or attempt they tried and reach out of help, then most people will not have a problem with it. That’s how we end up with answers that can be found on search engines.
What is the harm, to you or anyone else, when someone makes a forum their first resort, instead of last? If having people ask questions here that aren’t “good questions” according to you is bothering you, perhaps you are the problem.
My goodness, people complain that this place lacks content. A person as for help which creates content for the site and you come to bash on them?
Come kiddo! You can do better.
This post will not contain anything useful because the problem was never coherently defined and the follow ups from OP are minimal to none. Like most posts here, it will be left in limbo with no clear idea of what was tried or what didn’t work. It will be a useless web result hit for many people.
It’s really odd. I’m not seeing anyone say questions shouldn’t be asked. Yet that’s how most of the comments have interpreted it.
The problem is quality. We know there’s a good way to do this. One that will help people in the future and quickly assists OP today. While I agree the approach could be reworked, they are not wrong.
Google wouldn’t have any answers if no one ever asked their question in a forum instead.
What kind of mental gymnastics nonsense is this? If OP had googled and not found a result and explained their situation on what they tried and what did/did not work, then that’s how a valid forum question is asked and answer documented. lmao
a valid forum question
I wouldn’t presume to judge this, and I dont think you should.
There is no issue related to a deluge of “invalid” or even redundant forum questions. That’s simply not a real problem.
Then offer education or ignore the post. You know what’s easier than OP googling the question? You not responding to OP if you don’t have anything of value to add. You’re here with a passive aggressive “let me Google that for you” bullshit attitude yet YOU’RE upset at OP for not being better at searching for their answers?
I agree people should put more effort into trying to figure it out on their own and learning how to ask good questions but the tone of your comments is more detrimental to the quality of these communities than a “stupid question” ever will be.
This is SDDM, the default login manager used by KDE.
The Arch Wiki has an article about it, look under section 2.6.
Great answer!
If you’re using Wayland, you can go to Settings -> Colors & Themes -> Login Screen (SDDM) and click “Apply Plasma Settings…”
If you’re using X11, it looks like you’ll have to resort to hacky scripts, unfortunately.
Source: https://discuss.kde.org/t/how-to-change-monitor-layout-and-orientation-in-sddm/3377
Unfortunately, I’m having to use X11 because of work (context). Thanks for the help!
I suppose xrandr can help you here: See the Arch wiki about xrandr
This is why X11 is better. I’d rather have settings like this in a text file that I can copy over to my next machine than have to navigate a UI that will change on a different DE or the next upgrade.
Backwards compatibility, portability, and text-based interfaces are a virtue.
X config files aren’t “hacky scripts”, they are fundamentally more powerful, customizable, usable, and future-proof. Xrandr is a powerful and capable interface with applications across the system.
When Wayland adopts these kinds of powerful interfaces with decades of refinement I’ll switch to it. I don’t want to keep track of whether my DE uses wlroots or gnome or plasma and their independent/redundant/feature-lacking randr alternatives. Randrs should be more fundamental to the display operation than the DE. Wayland is fundamentally hacky and broken.
Not sure if you’re a troll, but if you’re serious, nothing I say is going to change your mind, so I won’t bother.
I am serious, and I’ll tell you exactly what will change my mind. I need real tools instead of “upgrades” that have less functionality and are less usable. If Wayland (or whatever comes next) can deliver on functionality, I’ll sing its praises. For now I’m on X.
Okay grandma, let’s get you to bed
Give me real tools or get off my
lawnrewilded patch of wildflowers!
Uh, all that button does is write your configuration to the sddm config. Of course you can also do that manually.
It’s not just about it being a config file, it’s also about having access to a powerful tool like xrandr within that config file.
wlr-randr
You can’t be this stupid, Wayland also uses a config file, you just have a GUI button to copy the configs from inside your session to the login screen. Or do you think the button recompiles the login screen with a different configuration?
Ironically SDDM itself still runs on X11 afaik, Wayland support is still experimental.
I think you have to manually enable it (may depend on your distro/DE) but SDDM works fine with Wayland as it stands now.
In Wayland, the compositor is the window server ( the equivalent of Xserver ). What you are looking for has to be a feature of the compositor and it is.
As others have said below, wlroots based compositors offer wlr-randr. There is also gnome-randr. For KDE, there is Kscreen-doctor. For X ( the window server being used by SDDM here ), there is xramdr.
Now, some people may see it as a problem that we have multiple Wayland implementations. I am mostly not fighting that battle. I will say that I hope these are not the same people that winge about systemd though and push for alternate init systems. I hope nobody that thinks MUSL is cool Is clinging to X11.
I would prefer that there was a common configuration standard for this stuff on Wayland. It will probably come eventually. Maybe as part of the freedesktop.org stuff.
Generally, I believe the Linux ecosystem has been stronger in areas where there has been competition between implementations ( even compilers ). I hope that Wayland will be one of those areas. As the core problems get fixed, the pace of innovation will increase. I believe we are already seeing that. There are more examples every day of things Wayland can do that X11 cannot. Let’s hope for more of that.
Thanks for pointing out that in this case the DM is using X regardless of whatever graphical environment gets loaded when the user logs in. This really is a moot point/discussion. I’m still glad I raised it to get perspectives like yours.
You’re right that I should play around with wlroots a bit more. It’s been a while, personally. Mostly because it’s been a while since I’ve had time to just play around with my system. My life is at a point that it looks like I’ll have that free time soon, for better or for worse.
I’ll note that I do like alternative init systems for diversity and competition and because systemd was very hungry and rigid. An init system is also a bit more fundamental to system stability than a display server, so I think it’s reasonable to be critical of systemd and Wayland for contradictory reasons. Systemd has also come a very long way in the past decade plus. I have also seen it learn from the other ideas implemented in its competition, mirroring your argument. Diversity and unification are not at odds with each other, but are different parts of the same cycle of improvement.
You left a very gracious reply so let’s not fight.
I see a certain amount of irony in the overlap between the group of people ranting that Wayland has too many implementations and the group demanding more implementations of everything else. So that was my point.
Certainly we can agree though that there is nothing wrong with demanding more of both.
One my favourite new distros, Chimera, uses both Wayland and dinit (and Turnstile ).
I am interested to see where the diversity that Wayland provides goes actually. Have you seen this?
Thanks for the leads and the good conversation. I have found that being an idiot in public and then deescalating is one of the fastest ways to gather information.
There are more examples every day of things Wayland can do that X11 cannot
What are the examples Wayland can do and X11 cannot?
Yeah that difference in configuration definitely makes it so much better, it completely outweighs the fact that Wayland does proper multi-monitor VRR, fractional scaling, HDR and much more.
Not OP comment but I had no idea Wayland supported all of that. Thanks for sharing! I really need to leave my Linux bubble more often.
And now you know why it’s so funny to read people on the internet exclaiming that X11 is so much better despite its lack of development…
I’ve never needed any of those things.
I do need to change monitor configurations.
I once had an old TV that I used as a monitor that had 1027p worth of pixels instead of 1080p. Auto detection tools said it was 1080p. With xrandr I was able to modify the output to 1027p so I didn’t lose the edges of the display to the TV’s broken forced overscan design. Could you do that with Wayland?
Literally yes. And you don’t even need to know the exact pixel resolution of the TV.
Edit: Here are the problems with you “Wayland isn’t good enough” people.
First, you don’t use Wayland, so you don’t even know if it’s fixed whatever weird issue you encountered with it before or if it supports a niche use case, for example.
Second, Wayland won’t get good enough for you until you start using it and reporting bugs. You think X11 was a bed of roses when it first started? Or do you think they bumped the version number 11 times for fun?
Good to know that this has been implemented in your favorite DE! Considering how Wayland often implements things, it’s probably implemented on the DE-level, leading to a fractured configuration ecosystem. Being implemented in Wayland is different from being implemented in some of the DEs that use Wayland.
edit: if I’m wrong about that, and it is implemented in Wayland itself, please continue to correct me!
First, you don’t use Wayland, so you don’t even know if it’s fixed whatever weird issue you encountered with it before or if it supports a niche use case, for example.
Bingo. So many complaints I’ve seen about Wayland have been from Nvidia users who tried it three years ago when the driver support was behind fucked. I get Linux development moves slow sometimes but holy shit…
I never configured anything on X with a DE, let it be KDE, Gnome or Cosmic, but configure everything with config files I can just copy on sway. It has nothing to do with X or Wayland, but the DE/WM you use.
That’s kind of my point. Something like randr is more fundamental than the DE, and its configuration shouldn’t be fractured by being DE-dependent. I personally don’t like DEs at all, and like the ability to control a more minimal system.
Oh, I didn’t know that button existed. Great! Even though I just tried it and it didn’t apply my rotation settings correctly.
I’m using Wayland, where do I find this settings gui?
This is the system settings application for the KDE desktop environment.
Ah, so being on Hyprland means I can’t really gain access to this, right?
XDG_SESSION_THEME=KDE got my hyprland config to work on everything except the cursor (other than in Firefox/steam for some reason). Took me way too long to find the old reddit post that had this tip, so I hope it helps!
Correct. Unfortunately, it’s something that each desktop environment or window manager has to implement themselves. But all the button is doing is moving some config files around, so you can probably do some digging to figure out what it’s copying to where.
Turn your head
That’s not the point here but can you share your wallpaper? 😄
I can’t remember where I found it, but here it is. I thought it might be from here (I’ve used these previously) but it is not.
The command is
swaymsg output DP-2 transform 90
Your screen on the left appears to be rotated vertically, rotate it 90 degrees clockwise and it should be better.
usually monitors can be freely rotated. if yours can’t, the back usually has a square vesa mount on the back and you can just take out the four screws and reattach it the way you like.
Put one hand on the top and one on bottom and rotate the screen by 90° or π/2 radians
If you have to read PDFs regularly having a vertical monitor is a lifesaver.
Easily fixable, just use Windows bro
If you think this is very witty and a gotcha, you’re wrong. This argument doesn’t work in reverse because whoever is using Linux already knows all about Windows, since, y’know, it has most of the Desktop market in its grip
This is like yelling about straight pride
It’s satirical/sarcastic, I even added the bro and everything. You see Linux users doing the same on every fucking Windows post so I couldn’t resist.
I’ve just been logging in upside down for a couple years. My monitor’s vesa Mount is like 3 inches from the top for some reason so having it upside down is the only way I can get a reasonable ergonomic height
Which display manager are you using?
I kinda love this aside from it being unusable
Rotate the left display 90 degrees clockwise. Now they’re both in landscape. Ta-da!
Sorry, I’ll see myself out.
