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i can agree on a few stuff, and can’t on some others. I just choose the most private options aviable that still serve the purpose i use them for. Like if you can find something on Google Play, Aurora, F-droid, obviously, it is better to download from f-droid, but if you have a bit more time, it is even better to download from source or even compile it yourself. But it always upsets me when people ask for privacy tips when using ios or windows, like are you joking or what? ditch those lol. And obviously, as a gamer, i wouldn’t use purist linux oses, like PureOS, because it can have serious issues with games. But i won’t buy nvidia if i want to game on linux, when i can get amd with open-source drivers on distros like Garuda. So i think a reasonable privacy can’t hurt anyone, but moving on just the next little step or going into the extremes are both not good ideas
I can’t recommend downloading from sources to normal people, and the problem is no, one step after step is better, as you can’t have a perfect solution for privacy btw, but moving from one service to one service lets say in one day, week or maybe even month is not realistic. Its like recommending a password manager, great, but then saying theres immediat need to change all password… Like, technically true, but realisticly, bank and mail firsts, then step by step some passwords, without forgeting new accounts should have now strong passwords.
As I said, ie my girlfriend knowing Im interested into privacy tell me that she just installed and created a protonmail account and she used Drive a bit, if I just say thats useless because there need compartimentalization and Proton gave IP to police, thats fckd up
The most private, the most secure option isn’t for everyone, first to threat model, second to personnal daily life
A person interested can still have Gafam apps, for some needs, required, but can limit the settings.
If you are a gamer, you mostly still need Windows computer (Linux got better and better, depends on games tho), then you can choose to say fck, or you can use it with limiting the stuff you can (turning off maximum settings you can, OsU10, etc.). Thats the same with iOS… Most people wont buy right now a new phone because of privacy, but maybe the next in few months or in 2 years ; doesnt mean during this period you can’t choose apps to use, turning off iOS features, etc…
For some projects I needed TikTok, I wrote myself a guide, to use it as anonymous as possible, to TikTok and to people, instead of using it raw, defaults
We love lemmy ❤️
What’s reddit? Is that like a new alternative to Lemmy? ;P
Reddit who?
how the hell did this get 51 upvotes
50 people clicked the up arrow below the comment.
While that is one possible reason, lets keep an open mind for any other possible ways that the comment gained votes.
Possibly a north korean bot willingly engaging in destabilyzing westeners fostering reddit circlejerk vapid culture.
Some people might have also clicked on a little bear.
A hexagonal bear
You’re almost there in down votes. Good job 🤣
It’s a good thing that free discussion doesn’t equate a mindless popularity contest. Oh wait, on Reddit it does, my bad …
Tbh I am done with reddit as a whole, back then a lot of mods were power tripping, but now most of them are. You can’t say anything, do anything, it would be better for them if no one would even visit their communities.
This is completely unsurprising tbh. A lot of the old mods were enthusiasts who grew a community from scratch due to their love for the subject. In the reddit API shutdown, a lot of those mods left in disgust, or were replaced by the reddit admins, or were driven off by the leftover toxic userbase calling them “entitled jannies” or whatever. A lot of the mods who took over their place were just power-hungry users who were chomping at the bit to get the chance to run a big community as their personal fiefdom because they were too toxic to grow one themselves.
This is the inevitable culmination of these events.
Anyway, welcome to lemmy. We become more powerful from every user who writes off reddit forever.
PS: if you see power-trippin’ behaviour around these parts, you can always post about it in [email protected]
Yeah, that sounds right. Well at least I am happy that I was checking lemmy year ago and now I decided to finally try it.
Also thanks for advice :D
To be fair there’s lots of power-tripping mods on lemmy as well, often using their colorful interpretations of subjective rules/terms to suppress opinions they don’t like.
I use a repost bot to keep up with the Monero reddit but most of the time I find that I’m not interested enough to actually click the link to go to the original post on reddit and so most of the time I just stay here. I deleted my account during the API issues back in June of 2023 and have not had an account since then and do not plan on going back as I really enjoy it here.
I don’t even think you need even a bot for that. Just grab the relevant RSS
It’s not my bot. It’s a bot somebody else created and I just use it.
Wait, what’s wrong with Proton Mail?
They gave meta information like IP to the government in Switzerland, where they are based, after the government forced them to with a court order. Not the encrypted mail, mind you, because they can’t do that, just the additional information they have on a user like email and IP.
Because of that, a lot of redditers on r/privacy think they spy on their users for the US government. It’s a stretch, yes, but you have to remember they take turns using the one brain they collectively have.
I guess the issue here is overselling the safety of the service. Wouldn’t rely on them encrypting the mail for you, for example. It’s probably fine if you treat it just like you would any other email service - assuming you’re fine with being unable to use a mail client at all on the free plan and using it in a weird roundabout way on the paid plans.
the issue is that they can’t defy the law without shutting down and going into jail. proton has given the tool the activist would have needed to protect themselves: the service has an official onion site, which would have made IP collection impossible, and they could have just said they can’t know it
Yes, that was exactly my point. You would not treat any mail service like they would cover you during your unprotected use, and Proton is not an exception. So I don’t understand why people are taking issue with them cooperating with LE - but I take issue with some other qualities.
So I don’t understand why people are taking issue with them cooperating with LE
some believe they (proton) are invincible and can do whatever they want. maybe because they think that’s what swiss privacy and swiss laws mean
Not the encrypted mail, mind you, because they can’t do that
Just want to point out for anyone new that ProtonMail does not use E2EE for email headers. That means they CAN access your subject lines, to/from fields, and other email headers. That means they CAN be forced to hand it over to the government.
Source: https://proton.me/support/proton-mail-encryption-explained
Subject lines and recipient/sender email addresses are encrypted but not end-to-end encrypted.
Personally I am disappointed in a lot of Proton’s wording about this. They frequently promise they can’t access “your data” and “your messages” when they do, in fact, store potentially sensitive data in a format they CAN access.
It’s email, that’s the best you can get with email, if you want to have more privacy, DON’T USE EMAIL
This is good advice, because email is very difficult to make reliably private. However, it’s not the best you can get. Tutanota, for example, stores headers with E2EE, and still has a search function.
The goal should be to make it as private as it can realistically be. Ideally, any cloud service you use should only store end-to-end encrypted data.
I’m not trying to shit on Proton — it’s a huge step up from the popular mainstream email services, and the inclusion of cloud storage makes it a much easier transition than going piecemeal with 2-5 different services.
A bit more context is important here. They aren’t E2EE, but they are stored encrypted. In the case of the person whose meta information was turned over, ProtonMail wasn’t forced to hand over the information right away, they were forced to collect it the next time that person accessed and used their email. That tells us that they didn’t store the information beforehand and could not access it without preparing to intercept it the next time their service was used.
Ultimately, though, if something like that’s a dealbreaker, it’s likely you’re doing something that would benefit from a more secure way of communicating than email.
Yeah I agree, sounds a bit excessive. If that’s correct, it doesn’t sound like they’re reading your data and at the end of the day they have to comply with things like warrants. Thanks for the clarification.
It is all also very clearly stated in the information they must collect in order to provide their service. There should’ve been no surprises here, as you must assume that scenarios like these will happen eventually.
If all they have on you is your optional backup email and your IP, I think they’re doing pretty well in the no data-collecting part?
Well, you don’t even need to provide an email or phone number when you sign up, so if you access the site via their onion address every time, they would have no information on you at all.
Privacy wise? Probably nothing. The company engages in shitty behavior, though, and will try to upsell you even if you’re a paying costumer. I switched to Tuta because of that, and then Tuta started doing all the same bs…
I don’t think OP was trying to say Proton Mail is bad or insecure. Rather the opposite.
I would also like to know, lol.
It’s proprietary.
“Welcome to Reddit! A community where you can determine what the mood and biases of the mod(s) are so you can safely post without getting banned or comments deleted.”
I ditched reddit, and what’s being described in this thread is largely part if why I left. I won’t go back.
Oh I remember r/privacy, this comment is spot on. You expect something like the Linux communities where it is okay what ever you prefer. But privacy-nerds sometimes goes the spying government/tech-firms rabbit-hole to deep.
Can’t Linux communities be just as bad? There’s constant bickering over systemd, snaps, canonical, red hat.
Yeah, but at least here on lemmy a lot of that doesn’t seem to be very serious and everyone is mostly ok with whatever you use. Don’t know how it was on reddit.
What’s the background here? Do they censor stuff?
Mention VPNs are forbidden due to spam and stuff, GrapheneOS mention forbidden because of drama
2nd part, community recommend too often just extrem stuff, not seeing that someone just moved away from Google or iOS or whatever big data service
Mention VPNs are forbidden due to spam and stuff, GrapheneOS mention forbidden because of drama
Defeats the whole purpose of the subreddit, it’s like saying you’re not allowed to talk about yellow in a community about colours…
Community about colours?
More like a community about the color orange and it’s related hues.
Now that’s a rule I can get behind.
Whats the story on GrapheneOS drama?
High level summary: A bunch of nerds got into a slapfight about who’s project is less secure, or who’s project is run by the feds. Some guys got doxxed or swatted, a few stepped away from their projects and left social media, and that’s about where we are today. It’s largely a bunch of clout-chasing nonsense.
At least one of the devs is an arrogant, condescending prick. Remember Nick the Computer Guy from SNL? He’s like 3 times worse than that. I’ve experienced it first hand - as in his second reply to me was to blame me: “you’re doing it wrong”. He’s exactly like some people I worked with 30 years ago. Smh.
There’s far more than that, though. In general, the Graphene team says everyone else is wrong. Classic idealist attitude.
I run DivestOS now because of that interaction, I will never use Graphene. That dev can go fuck himself with a pineapple - had enough of his kind of childishness decades ago.
Having had a disagreement with Miguel De Icaza that boiled down to him saying “Well I have these books on my shelf so I’m right” (narrator: he wasn’t right, it was hilarious later).
I will never, ever touch Gnome. I get it.
Lol brave sucks
It does, but it’s a step in the right direction.
I’m as guilty as anyone for allowing pursuit of perfection be the enemy of good.
How is allowing crypto mining in your browser or hijacking affiliate links good for privacy?
Brave has a built-in adblocker and is not Chrome. If a user is able to make the switch to Brave, they might find it easier when they try to switch to something better like Librewolf or Firefox.
Why would switching browsers twice make it any easier?
Because once you learn how to switch browsers once, you already know what the process of changing browsers looks like and what to expect, removing the barriers if you switch again.
It’s like switching from Windows to Ubuntu. Sure, Ubuntu is not perfect, but by installing Ubuntu, you have already learned the process of installing a linux distro and what to expect if you decide to install a different one.
Except brave doesn’t teach them how to block ads or mine crypto so I still fail to see how if they were to switch to brave it would make their switch to a sane browser less painful. They just have to switch twice instead of once.
Literally the kind of elitist response the OP was lambasting.
No, noobs need to be told what sucks and what doesn’t.
Okay, I’ll have a go, since you’re a noob with people and how they actually learn and behave: Your advice sucks.
What advice
… so what doesn’t? Just saying <thing> sucks without saying why or providing a valid alternative is not helping anyone. Rather say something like
“Brave has done some shady things in the past and is based on chromium which is currently doing its best to kneecap adblockers and other privacy tools. If you want a good private browser, you might want to use librewolf instead”.
The “little steps” idea, though helpful in other places, doesn’t really apply under surveillance capitalism. If one company gets some small bit of info about you they will sell that data to everyone else, and the government has access to those data as well. Being a little safer sometimes doesn’t do much. You really have to go all the way or don’t bother
I also got DMs asking why it’s removed or if I got banned, + someone asking and saying in topic it’s the 3rd in short time.
The real privacy nerds: paying for a service? Leaving a paper trail? Learn how to pwn grandma computers and push all your internet through that. /s
Unsurprising behavior from a community where the coolest person is the one who can put on the biggest tin foil hat. I appreciate the privacy community here but I think the concept itself leads to users decrying anything as insecure just because it makes them feel more knowledgeable.
My guess is, the people who care didn’t stick around. As s result, quality went down.
