Due to recent incidents regarding LinkOpensChest.wav he has voluntarily chosen to step down as moderator of LibertyHub. I will be taking full authority and control over the situation. All concerns should be brought to me.

  • New head moderator of LibertyHub, kittenzrulz123
  • mindbleach@sh.itjust.works
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    3 months ago

    … wait, this started over someone demanding incorrect capitalization? That’s not what pronouns are. That’s not what gender is!

    I have misgivings about LinkOpensChest.wav, but only because they run a no-disagreement-permitted propaganda megaphone community with negative self-awareness. This? This is a non-issue. This is the opposite of an issue. Grail is just wrong about how anything works.

    There is the concept of gender, as a spectrum, and you can be anywhere on it, and you can be off it entirely. Getting mad that people don’t address you as “her” is a serious fucking issue. Getting mad that people don’t address you as “Her Royal Majesty” is a joke. I could even see people getting miffed about a catch-all “they” instead of using their username, even though that’s like taking offense to being addressed as “you.” But I don’t get to demand people exclusively refer to me as “the person who is always right about everything.”

    At its core:

    Nobody gets their own pronouns.

    Those are called… nouns.

    Pronouns are generic indirect stand-ins. English happens to have several gendered sets. Some languages don’t. Because gender is a big deal (at present) people can specify which set feels appropriate for them. But it’s a selection. You pick from the ones that exist. There was some chance of a tumblr-ish xe/xer emerging, if only to maintain conjugated tense better than they/them… but that was never going to coexist with ze/zer and whatever else. Those are not distinct enough to bother making them additional unique exceptions to the English language. A minority of millions had a specific need. That’s not an invitation for every last rando to demand respect for whatever they make up.

    Could someone demand we speak of them exclusively in French?

    Could someone demand we speak of them in first-person, like that SCP about a haunted toaster?

    Could someone demand we… never speak of them? That any effort to address them as an individual is a slur?

    These demands are not much sillier than clutching pearls over grammatical English. When we refer to that user, we cannot be expected to capitalize That User, as if that’s the same fucking problem as misgendering. This whole debacle is an insult to the severity of misgendering. So far as I can see, LinkOpensChest.wav correctly gendered Grail, they just didn’t bother playing by any additional made-up rules.

    This is especially dumb when those rules are explicitly rooted in a claim to divinity. I’d break that shit on principle. There cannot be bigotry in treating someone as human.

    Anyone who wants to disagree with me must use Old English thee/thou/thine for the second-person. My username has capitalized vowels during local business hours. Anyone who agrees with me can do whatever they want.

    • ToastedPlanet@lemmy.blahaj.zone
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      3 months ago

      This drama got started over not capitalizing a pronoun. From a perspective of wanting to get people’s pronouns correct, the underling reason why a group of people would want pronouns referring to members of that group capitalized doesn’t matter. The fact a person asked for the pronouns in question to be capitalized should be reason enough to do so.

      There are people who use emojis as pronouns. Like (🙂🎃/💃🕶️) or 🎱. The combinations are unique to every individual and can change. These people’s experience with gender is highly individual and cannot be put into words. They are all welcome and accepted by the LGBTQ+ community.

      https://lgbtqia.wiki/wiki/Emojiself_Pronouns

      • mindbleach@sh.itjust.works
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        3 months ago

        They’re getting they/them’d if they don’t prefer one of the other two options.

        Some people are men or women or both or neither. Nobody is a goddamn pumpkin. Even actual pumpkins don’t get special articles for indirection. Mere objects are it/its. No “experience of gender” can make you a supernatural entity, or… produce.

        Labels unique to an individual are called names. Pronouns are what go in place of that. We have several. Take your pick.

        • ToastedPlanet@lemmy.blahaj.zone
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          3 months ago

          Grammar isn’t a tool to constrain thought. Grammar is a tool to assist in writing.

          Gender is a social construct. Gender is made up. People experience gender in different ways. Some people experience gender in ways that cannot be put into words.

          If you can’t tolerate people here using pronouns that challenge your world view, this instance is not for you. We are not interested in conforming to your personal view of gender. We do not tolerate intolerance.